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What's it all about?
Published on March 6, 2008 By Jythier In Religion

It's... gasp! another Christian article.  Skip it if you don't want to read another Christian article.  Here, I'll put in this 'more' tag so that you won't have to read any of the substance if you don't want to.

 

Still with me?  Good!  There's no substance in here, either, but hey, I didn't say there would be.


So some people pray, some meditate, some have quiet time, some do none of that.  What's the difference, and why does anyone care?

First off, I need to define meditation and quiet time, which I will lump together as 'not prayer'.  It is my understanding that the reason one meditates is to either think more clearly or clear one's head completely.  This may enhance focus, concentration, and a whole bunch of other positive effects. 

The difference between prayer and meditation is that meditation focuses on oneself while prayer focuses on God.  You can pray selfishly, for sure.  You can just ask God for things that will make your life easier.  There are things He's just sitting up there, waiting for you to ask Him for. Ask and you shall receive, knock and the door will open.  But the focus is what God can do, not what you can do.


I have also been told to 'meditate' on scripture.  I have no idea what this means.  I think it means 'contemplation' of the scripture, thinking about it, turning it over in your head, and letting the Holy Spirit guide you to the correct meaning of the scripture.  I've never done this, so how should I know?

As for prayer, I find it difficult to believe it.  That doesn't mean I should disbelieve it, or that I don't believe it... it just means it's hard for me to give prayer the importance that God quite obviously gives it repeatedly in the Bible.  Apparently, in Revelations, the prayers of the Saints are kept in bowls.  That's how precious our prayers are to God, He keeps them.  So, since God created everything, including us, he has pretty much everything.  The only thing we have left to give Him is ourselves, and we do that only through prayer.

There are spiritual disciplines, but God does NOT call his Temple the House of Preaching, the House of Music, the House of Bible Reading, etc. etc.  Jesus said that the Temple would be called a House of Prayer.  So, logically, what would you say is the purpose of Bible reading, preaching, music, and all that?  It's to lead everyone into prayer!  That's all it's about.

Why does God want everyone to be saved?  So we will all pray to Him.  Converse with Him.  Fellowship with Him.

Don't get me wrong here.  I'm not saying he NEEDS are prayers.  He WANTS our prayers.  He is willing to limit himself based upon what we pray for.  It does say 'ask and you shall receive' not 'don't ask and you'll get it anyway.'  So ask.  Because God has everything you need, and He wants to give it to you.

So, some people might say that prayer is just a tool.  You pray, which makes you go out and get whatever it is you prayed for under your own power, and if you don't, you just say it was God's will.  Well, yeah, that happens sometimes I'm sure.  But if you're constantly praying to God for something he doesn't want you to have, you're going to know about it.

But the real proof against prayer being just a tool, is this:  People can tell when they're being prayer for, especially when they're being prayer for by a large group.  People pray, God responds.

One of the things to remember is that the most effective prayers are when 2 or more Christians (or is it 3?  Well, just fill a room, that'll do the trick) are in agreement over a prayer.  Why isn't a single prayer as effective?  Is it because there's more people involved?

I don't think that.  I think it's because, in order for two people to agree about a prayer, it can't be a selfish prayer.  It has to be a prayer that is really modeled after God's heart, and that is why you need more than one person.  A kind of test.

Quiet, alone time prayer is good for reflection and for contemplation, and for increasing your relationship with God.  But what really separates it from non-prayer is when people do it corporately.  That's where the real power is.  That's where the proof is.  That's where the world is changed.

Revival starts when the people pray.  People don't pray now.  I mean, some people do, but I'd put a lot of money down right now that the majority of people who call themselves Christians did not pray today, at all.  The majority of people who are truly saved probably didn't fare much better. 

Saul was a terrible persecutor of Christians, but he changed.  God sent someone to meet him, and when the guy was scared to go, God said that he could go, because Saul prays.  That was it for God.  He prays, he's all right, go meet him.

Why do we neglect such an important part of our Christianity?  That's easy.  Because you feel silly when you pray.  You're talking out loud to a being you've never seen.  At least when you do it in your head you can pretend on the outside you're not praying.  But if you're speaking aloud, everyone is going to hear you... and what you're saying... and think you're crazy... crazy!

You're not crazy.  Satan wants you to think you're crazy, and he absolutely DOES NOT want you to pray, because it mobilizes armies against him.  So pray anyway.  Cast out demons.  Interceed.  Pray for other's salvations.  Pray with other believers, and the Bible guarantees that God will respond.  And He will be very happy, and keep your prayers in bowls.  Seriously.


Comments (Page 2)
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on Mar 07, 2008
You notice how it all mentions fear is good? Isn't that strange? Love through fear...isn't that what we call an abusive relationship these days?


No. We call an abusive relationship one where someone is being abused.
on Mar 07, 2008
No. We call an abusive relationship one where someone is being abused.


Psychological abuse is still abuse.

"Love and accept me or you're going to hell."

Well, I kinda have to love Him or I'm going to be screwed.


Could be comparable to some psychopath saying:

"Love me or I'll beat you....for eternity."

Not a great set of options.

~Zoo
on Mar 07, 2008
You do it again. You make it sound like it's God threatening you when God does no such thing. YOU choose to turn away and go to the one who will beat you for all eternity. I gave this analogy before, but it bears repeating.

God is like a man who finds a pimp beating a prostitute, who then rescues the prostitute, and takes her back to his care. He nurses her back to health, and when she is well, he asks her to stay with him forever and be his wife.

She runs back to the pimp to be mistreated more. And he'll keep going back and rescuing her until she's dead, or stays.

It's never God who threatens, and it's never Him who sends them back.
on Mar 07, 2008
I don't see why sinless mortal blood had to be spilled for our sins...though it does tie into the yearly murder of the lamb thing.(God sure likes His blood.) Anywho, being all powerful should allow you to...well, you know be kind of a cool guy and not send a human vessel to get the absolute crap beaten out of him then hung up on a stick to die. In all honesty, that's being kind of a dick to Jesus.


Jesus was in on it, Zoo. Jesus wanted to go. He was honored by it, and we still sing His praises over doing it for us. What good would be forgiving everyone if we did not know God? What good would heaven be?

God has mercy, but He also has wrath. I don't know why He decided to flood the earth. I don't know why he destroyed entire cities. Maybe, and this is a big maybe, he flooded the earth because no-one asked him not to!

Who am I that God has to plead to me?


I don't know. Who are you?

Send your kid out in the woods and ask God to protect'em. Would you do it?


I like to think God already protected my kids by giving me the wisdom not to send them into the woods alone.
on Mar 07, 2008
God is like a man who finds a pimp beating a prostitute, who then rescues the prostitute, and takes her back to his care. He nurses her back to health, and when she is well, he asks her to stay with him forever and be his wife.


Well if God picked up every prostitute being beaten by a pimp...he'd have a full house.


You neglect to say that God created the pimp in the first place....but...whatever.

God has mercy, but He also has wrath.


That may be an understatement. He has homicidal rage.

he flooded the earth because no-one asked him not to!


That's horrifying thought, Jyth. Must we ask everyday for God not to kill the entire planet again? "Dear God, please don't kill us. Thanks! "

I don't know. Who are you?


Who are any of us?

I like to think God already protected my kids by giving me the wisdom not to send them into the woods alone.


Well you sure can sidestep a question, can't you? That's commendable, I don't meet many people that can do that effectively.

~Zoo

on Mar 07, 2008
Well you sure can sidestep a question, can't you? That's commendable, I don't meet many people that can do that effectively.


My name's Nimble, and I live in Dodge City.

I did not dodge the question, I answered the question. God gives us wisdom and we have the responsibility to use it. When things are out of our control, which they often are, pray! But don't put people in danger just to prove God will protect them. Do not test the Lord your God.
on Mar 07, 2008
But don't put people in danger just to prove God will protect them. Do not test the Lord your God.


Nah...that never ends well, does it? Otherwise all the rape and murder would stop...but you know how it goes.

~Zoo
on Mar 07, 2008

Feel free to ask questions I can't answer or debate/discuss whatever I've written and completely outclass me intellectually. I don't really know much, except that I blathered on a great deal more than I usually do, so I probably got at least one thing right in that mess.

My, my you are so hard on yourself....it's a very good article especially your wrap up last paragraph.

 

What seems to happen all too often is that we, in our weak and feeble nature,  don't pray until the going gets rough.

I'd like to expand a little on what you've written.

St. Paul urges, "Pray without ceasing" and one might ask how can this possibly be done. But according to Corinthians and Eph. 2: 10-15,  the whole Christian life is a prayer of union with Christ in His Mystical Body....so that's pretty phenomonal.

 

 

 

 

on Mar 07, 2008
Nah...that never ends well, does it? Otherwise all the rape and murder would stop...but you know how it goes.


*sigh* I know you're antagonistic towards organized religion, Zoo, we ALL know. But let me just tell you, God will NEVER force anyone to do anything. We all have the agency and the freedom to do what we choose. We simply can't choose the consequences. So yes, God created the pimp, but he didn't force the pimp to be a pimp. Pimp-y chose that life all by his own self.


St. Paul urges, "Pray without ceasing" and one might ask how can this possibly be done. But according to Corinthians and Eph. 2: 10-15, the whole Christian life is a prayer of union with Christ in His Mystical Body....so that's pretty phenomonal.


To me, "pray without ceasing" tells me to always keep a prayer in my heart. To always remember him. I don't think it means be on your knees all day, head bowed, praying out loud, but to let God in on all aspects of your life. I changed pronouns there. Oops.
on Mar 07, 2008

Jythier posts:

What'd the apostles do?

They said, "Lord, teach us to pray". Christ answered the request by by teaching us the most perfect prayer..the Lord's Prayer. It teaches us to hallow God's name, and to do God's will perfectly on earth as it is in Heaven. He also taught us to pray for temperal and spiritual favors too, such as grace to overcome temptation, the forgiveness of our sins and the grace of final perseverance.

Texas Wahine posts:

So if I'm not righteous, is my prayer a waste of time? How would one know if they are righteous? Despite my best efforts, I have never felt confident that I was righteous.
Jythier posts:
What'd the apostles do?

St.Matt 5 tells us He promised to receive our prayer when it came from a loving heart, "for if you know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father from Heaven give the good Spirit to those who ask Him?"

 

Zoo posts:

Isn't it force to threaten us with hell at every little turn? Don't follow the rules and you burn forever in eternal hellfire...yeah, there's no fear or anything to go along with that, eh? I always thought that was a little weird. To say we have a choice when the only alternative to eternal happiness is eternal pain and anguish. Scare the Christians with hellfire, let'em choose. Doesn't that lead to a religion based on fear rather than love? That's a consequence I hear Christians spout off, "You'll go to hell if you don't believe." "You'll go to hell if you do that." and many variations. A lot of them focus on the negative. Catholic schools I hear are notorious for the "Going to Hell" threat.

I'm Catholic and if someone asks me are you afraid of Hell? I say, of course I am. Nothing wrong with that. It has a way of putting things in proper perspective too. Knowing Hell is a reality, any sane person will live so as to avoid going there. This is ordinary prudence.  Take the example of a man leaping for his life off a railroad track as the train is coming. Do we say, you coward, you jumpted for your life for shear fear of that train?  God gave us our reason that we might use it for our well being and it is quite reasonable to weigh both advantages and penalties attached to moral law.  

Each of us is endowed with reason and is bound to exercise foresight. In life if you don't follow the rules, there's hell (of sorts) (consequences) to pay isn't there? Look...we are created as eternal beings....this life on earth is a pin prick in time compared to eternal life which we all have...either in eternal happiness or in eternal hellfire.

Since there is a future life, it has alot to do with morality and obeying the rules in this life. The future as such is a reasonable motive for present conduct. I refrain from eating certain foods for future indigestation will surely result later and so on and so forth. That is reasonable conduct. I try to refrain from morally wrong conduct becasue iot is wrong, it offends God, is a personal disgrace,  and will wrack my whole future existence if I persist in it  dying without repentance. All these motives are good. If the nobler motives fail to impress me in a given temptation, the thought or fear of Hell at least will give me pause to think and hopefully stop me.

The knowledge that retributation will follow violations of the moral law makes that law a real law. Could we say that all the penalties attached to the laws of the state are to the bad? Temptation to  Crime is resisted everyday becasue of the thought of future penalties. In the next life the principle is the same.

     

on Mar 07, 2008
God will NEVER force anyone to do anything.


Nor will he stop them.


Then again...I suppose that's why the earth is fun, or horrifying depending on which end of the line you end up on.

~Zoo
on Mar 07, 2008
I'm Catholic and if someone asks me are you afraid of Hell? I say, of course I am. Nothing wrong with that.


Perhaps if it's your own personal fear it's fine...but do you threaten others with it? Nonbelievers and the like? It's not a great way to conduct oneself if you're trying to get recruits.

I'm not keen on being threatened or coerced into things.

I know you can counter with the "But God loves you" part...still there are two sides to this coin. One side is, "I'm going to drop you like a stone into lava."...that's the one that bothers me...sure the, "Happy fluffy cloud bliss paradise super awesome fun heaven." side sounds good...but maybe I'm not always looking at the glass half full.

*sigh* I know you're antagonistic towards organized religion, Zoo, we ALL know


Yikes, take it easy...I'm just asking questions. Figurin' out the faith, if you will. I like understanding people's rationale.

~Zoo
on Mar 07, 2008

But each of us has in us that nature that says, "No, we don't need God, we can do it ourselves!"

True. They mimic Satan who said, I will not serve.

Zoo posts:

Although I can see how we survive without God...seeing as how I never see his presence or feel it.

If you can't see it right now at this point in your life, perhaps you'll just have to take other people's word for it....Every breath you take...everything that is about you is a gift from God. In the hot summer day when that fresh cooling breeze comes along and refreshes you...say thank you God. When you gaze at an incredible sunrise or sunset, say thank you God. When you see love freely given say thank you God.

Zoo posts:

Then we have all the horrible things that happen to innocent people, children even...where is God then? When a small child is kidnapped, molested, and murdered? He ain't a whole lot of help there is He?

Even with our limited capacity, we've aleardy seen there is a God. And here we see proposals which seemingly go along way toward His removal....NOT.

This litany of things you have described is evil...sin in the world. Evil is really the negation or privation of good. ANd yes, there is evil in the world, but there is also much good which can be accounted for by the existence of God.

We cannot have God when things seem to be alright and then annialiate Him when things go wrong. Viewing people as a whole we find that life is a mixture of good and evil, comfortable and uncomfortable...when one person is happy and content, another is miserable and suffering, poor, etc. We can't say that God exists for the happy ones and not for the poor suffering ones. When we see this uneven distribution with pain and suffering for some, God's providence has not failed. Man himself is at fault. 

As far as the justice of God when it comes to these crimes a satisfactory explanation could scarcely be given were this life all there is. But it is not. God permits these things only because He knows that there is a future life where He will compensate all inequalities. In the meantime, He draws good out of these miseries for they teach men not to set their hopes on entirely upon this world as if there were no other and help to expiate the sins of mankind.  No one can be entirely happy here....but so in the next life.

  

on Mar 07, 2008

Lula posts:

I'm Catholic and if someone asks me are you afraid of Hell? I say, of course I am. Nothing wrong with that.

Zoo posts: Perhaps if it's your own personal fear it's fine...but do you threaten others with it? Nonbelievers and the like?

 

No, I've no power to threaten people with Hell...and furthermore it would be a sin for me to do so for surely wishing or hoping someone to Hell is hateful.

Rather, re: Hell, I tell them the truth as best as I can and  let it settle in their craw.

 

on Mar 07, 2008

I like understanding people's rationale. ~Zoo

Me too. People are simply fascinating.

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